UPDATE (3/11/2010): We noticed that this post has been getting a lot of traffic, and we have deduced that it’s because of Sasha Grey, so we decided to add this visual foreword hipping you to a number of other beautiful and talented women we’ve come across:
Click it:
A notice in the window at 988 Valencia Street confirms the city will hold a hearing on Thursday, February 5, at 1:30pm, to consider the viability of an American Apparel in the Mission:
Sasha Grey American Apparel Ad courtesy of The Reverse Cowgirl.
Previously:
American Apparel Comes to the Mission (with lots of healthy debate in the comments)
: We noticed that this post has been getting a lot of traffic, and we have deduced that it’s because of Sasha Grey, so we decided to add this visual foreword hipping you to a number of other beautiful and talented women we’ve come across: Click it: A notice in the window at 988 […]</p>
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thanks allan. i’m gonna try to go to the meeting.
be interesting to know how this will go. i imagine that even if it passes the planning commission – and it probably won’t, because MAC will send it’s tax subsidized army of blight lovers there to vote nay – that will be appealed to…the BoS? i am not sure of the process.
anyone know the process?
i’ll also try to call after the date and get a real time & report back.
Hooray for American Apparel! I woud go to the meeting, but unlike MAC NIMBYs, I hae a job.
Lame. Agreed with Drew – I’d go, but I’ll be at work. Thursday at 1:30, really? I hope people show up.
I can’t quite figure out exactly why I hate the idea of an American Apparel on my block. It’s not like they’re “running out” some family-owned business or something. (R.I.P., Sanchez office; I’m glad I have your couch.) I just really, really don’t want them there. This is probably an indicator that I shouldn’t go to the meeting. Hipster arguments help no one.
I will try and make it as well. Might be tough to get out of work at 1:00 on Thursday though.
vagina!
yeah. i’d say “thanks all” but i don’t get the sense that everyone is agreeing with me that this would be a good thing…;-)
anyways, whatever you think, if you CAN go to the meeting, then go. i dont know if i will be able to get out of work either….but the ONLY way for anyone to get what they want is to get involved.
i’m no lover of AA either – frankly they dont make anything that fits an overindulgent 42 year old guy, but i’m working on it, new years resolutions and all…and the teen porn is a little gross – but there’s no reason to prevent them from opening a store that will sell stuff that people living in the hood will buy.
not EVERYONE needs to shop in EVERY store. if SOME of the people will patronize, it’s enough, and it’s CLEARLY better than a derelict storefront. let the market decide….
MAC will disagree. so might some readers here.
i dont shop at the bong store, and i dont like eating at chachacha. i dont frequent check cashing places, i dont flop in an SRO, i dont like weird fish. i dont go to medjool. i don’t shop at the mexican cowboy store, or at seigel’s, or the hipster shoe place, and i dont like shwarma.
but i respect those places having the right to set up a business. if no one shops there, they’ll close.
my guess is that AA will have a fairly robust business in the hood.
i lifted this from the comment section on SFGATE regarding the apparent failure of (unattended, poorly managed) crime cameras to reduce crime. it’s usually a bunch of nutbags on there, but this one made sense:
“If the neighbors of a high crime area are truly concerned about the state of their neighborhood, the only way (this side of gentrification) that they’ll get the problem under control is to get off their butts and take control of their neighborhood; organize neighborhood watches, work with the police to document and report crimes and hot spots, and to make life unpleasant for the criminal. Reliance on technology erodes our freedom and does little to nothing to stop crime. Crime exists because no one cares. Look at the high crime areas of the City and they’re all in borderline or low income areas where no one gives a damn. The merchants don’t keep the sidewalks clean, the public litters like pigs, everyone does what they want until someone crosses a line, and then they’re all out wringing their hands. It would help if the Mayor and our pols didn’t pander to the public as they do, but ultimately it’s a problem of and with the people.”
Who cares? It’s another t-shirt shop on a street with many (most of which print on AA shirts…).
I guess the old adage is true:
…gentrification is anything that wasn’t there before you moved in…
heh. that’s a good one.
I wonder if in this market if they’ll really open it? I also wonder if some of the existing shops will survive. It’s pretty grim out there. There are still two more waves of bad mortgages to come due later this year and next. If the trends continue on pace we’re due for some serious unemployment. I’m hopeful that the feds will get their act together, but the state, and especially the city have their heads firmly in their posterior orifice. Watch as taxes increase at the local level to try to meet a budget gap in a death spiral that”ll get bigger as taxes increase and business activity decreases. I once met the president of BofA Ireland. He explained the Irish economic miracle. That they sussed 12% of something was worth more than 25% of nothin’
damn, that bitch needs to shave.
@neo displacer. I’m sure you think its that simple, but it isn’t. Ireland’s miracle was built on becoming the Delaware of the EU. These days things aren’t going so great with that. Second, yes, of course you don’t really want to raise taxes in a recession, its counter-cyclical in the Keynsian sense. But in california we have been effectively cutting taxes at the state and local level since the early 80s (prop 13). The only thing keep the government afloat was property and transaction tax revenue from the bubble. So our choices are: cut spending or cut taxes. Both are really bad in a recession. Raising taxes on the wealthy, while bad, is not as bad as cutting services and infrastructure, because those things employ people who spend their money (and many more people). Feel free to disagree.
@zinzin: I think your post pretty much sums up my view — except that I can’t understand why you don’t like shwarma.
ha. probably i never had a good one. frankly, they never seem…fresh to me.
who has a good one? how do i order it?
Goood Frikin Chicken had the first good shwarma I had in SF, old jerusalem has the best shwarma I’ve ever had in a restaurant. Both are about the same price but I’m gonna reallly recommend going to old jerusalem sometime. There’s a check cashing place across the street worth checking out too.
I’m deeply worried about the independent merchants on Valencia and Mission Sts. and how they’re gonna survive the Bush Depression.
@Stephen
It’s probably too late for a reply to reach you, but the AA story was on SFist and it reminded me to go here. I have a couple of thoughts for you, one is the tremendous inequity of the property taxes as structured now. Mine are $6000 per year on 1100 square feet while my neighbor’s is $850 on about 6000 square feet. So the tax code is fubar thanks to prop13 but you rent right? Inequity in taxes is as pernicious as inequality in the rest of life. I would favor a rationalization of property taxes. I ask you, do you think I’m rich living in 1100 square feet in the mission?
The second thought I have is about business taxes in general, except in the case where your trying to guide behavior, like trying to adjust for the true cost of energy and decouple it from subsidies by instituting carbon taxes, I think they’re a bad idea. The costs on business are passed to the consumer, a fairly regressive thing, or to stay competitive, businesses flee the high tax areas, or there is a negative arbitrage effect on a locality as money floats away from San Francisco and California to Fresno and Arizona and finally to China. When I got here in 1990 there a blacksmith, a cooper, a box factory, and a thriving textile industry. These are gone. Now we talk about being green, about being locavores, about acting locally etc. Wouldn’t it be grand to have a self sustaining local economy as it was in the 20th C? It would be green, it would help poverty, it would give people meaningful work. But I’m afraid when you have governments that are self interested, that believe that they need to continue to support massive budgets, through continued tax increases while providing marginal gains in services, the whole scheme will collapse around us leaving us with nothing. Not a responsive government that cares for our welfare, nor an economy to nurture us. It will leave in some kind of weird soviet era milieu of desperation and utter hopelessness.
i hope you all have seen this bunk:
http://stopamericanapparel.wordpress.com/
whatever your thoughts on it, i urge you to get involved.
the number on the poster above is: 575-9084. The planner’s name is apparently Melissa LaValley. Her email is melissa.lavalley@sfgov.org. call her, email, her and tell her what you think.
it’s insane that they do these meetings during the day, but there you go. here’s the comments i left on their little protest sight. it will be interesting to see if they actually post them.
the notion that AA represents “them” is ridiculous and arcane.
the notion that the neighborhood “5 years ago” is something for which we should strive reeks of the very worst type of ideologue bullshit.
the notion that a “precedent” would be set, and that this is a reason to halt development – to forbid a business from setting up in a currently derelict storefront in these trying times – is naive and selfish.
there is NO GOOD REASON to prevent AA from moving into this small storefront in the neighborhood. NO GOOD REASON.
if no one likes their stuff…they won’t shop there. but guess what….you all know people DO like their stuff….and THEY WILL SHOP THERE.
that’s reason enough to call this entire protest a sham. a complete sham.
…
here’s another thought for all you closed minded nimby hipsters.
did you ever consider that – even though you may not like it, and even though it may not ascribe to your narrow minded view of “should” – the neighborhood has changed, and is changing. there’s LOTS more families, and homeowners, and people of all types in the Mission now…
did you ever think that, even if the people that might shop at AA aren’t as “cool” as you….they might be from out of the neighborhood, or, they might just be a regular-person-grownup that happens to live here (i know that would be REALLY outside your desired demographic), …they might ALSO shop at DEMA or THERAPY?
is it that only “cool” people are allowed to shop at your stores? you dont want any dirty mommy money or any filthy yuppie money? i mean seriously…in these times…are we REALLY going to say “i’d rather have fewer customers….i dont want anyone different than me shopping on valencia street”?
lastly, there’s been a few comments about how AA will never employ any local folks (ie brown people). well, firstly, NONE of the hipster businesses i see on Valencia (with DEMA and THERAPY being 2 of the longest standing) employ any local folks (ie brown people) either. maybe i’m wrong there, but that’s what i see. privileged hipsters tend to stick together, xenophobes that they are.
and also, i can promise that AA WILL employ local people…specifically, local hipsters. there is no question there. as i said, “local” now has many definitions.
jeez, the more i think about this, the more sad it is. a bunch of over-educated, privileged white folks bitching & moaning about how the neighborhood “should” be….wanting to keep it all for themselves, and haveit forever mirror their own selfish, narrow values.
honestly, it doesnt sound very much different from any other nimby movement, like rich people in noe valley or aaron peskin in north beach.
really, it’s pathetic.:
and here’s the letter i sent to the Planning person. feel free to copy & paste…
To whom it may concern:
We are writing to implore you to consider American Apparel as a positive element in a neighborhood in dire need of positive elements. It is our hope that a business seeking to invest in this community during these difficult economic times is seen as a good thing.
We are aware that other parties will criticize American Apparel’s desire to move into the community. They will compare this small company and small storefront to WalMart, or Home Depot. They will say that American Apparel will “kill the neighborhood”.
As longtime Mission residents and homeowners, we walk down Mission Street and Valencia Street multiple times, every day. While we have an amazing, diverse and vibrant neighborhood and community….one of the main things one can see is blight. Empty storefronts abound, and these are a magnet for crime, garbage and graffiti.
Any notion that a business opening on Valencia Street will “kill the neighborhood” is, in our view, politically motivated, and not community motivated.
It is our opinion that if the community does in fact not want American Apparel here, they will not shop the store, and the store will close.
It is also our opinion that should American Apparel be given the proper, fair and (let’s face it) American opportunity to open, they will succeed, because people in our community WILL in fact shop there.
Thank you for your attention, and again, we implore you to allow American Apparel the right to do business in our community…the right to help us improve it.
Hey, I’m a Mission resident and I’m trying to get more involved with the community — to put in my $.02 and be a part of making it a good place to live, work, visit, and what have you. I love to see blog comment threads that let people speak their mind and share their perspectives. (And make jokes about pubic hair.) I think that this is a good forum and resource for everyone, including the people who can’t go to, won’t go to, or didn’t hear about planning commission meetings.
So, given that preamble, I just want to beg, on bended knee, that everyone who adds their opinion to the public record via comment threads and message boards take just 10 extra minutes to let their thoughts settle, re-read their posts, and do some editing. I’m not saying that there isn’t a place for passion, for vehemence, even for some polite name-calling, but what really saddens me is when the adrenaline of rising to debate and declaring one’s own authority overwhelms the argument itself.
It’s always sad to read self-defeating prose in these threads. And ultimately I think it does more to polarize people and cement differences of opinion than it does to help change anyone’s mind. And, believe me, despite what you may read on blog comment threads, not everyone’s mind is already made up about every issue.
So there’s my plea for civility and self-editing. I hope it doesn’t come off as holier-than-thou. Believe me, it’s not meant to. I genuinely respect the opinions expressed here and I want to make Mission Mission a better place to read, visit, discuss things. I’d love to post something similar to SFGate, but it seems to me that, in that case, all hope is lost.
dear Harold, what exactly is the point of your post? hugs, everyone else.
have you ever read the sfgate comments? they’re as violent as the internet gets.
Dear Harold:
let zinzin’s words fly. He tells it like it is. no self-editing necessary.
oh yeah and:
penus
thx yo.
Dear Meave: Cliff’s Notes verson is: Zinzin, I agree with you. But don’t be a dick in a comment thread. It’s counter-productive. Labeling people “over-educated” “privileged” “Nimby” “hipster” etc etc and using all caps for emphasis undermines the argument. Chill out. That was my point.
Fsharp: I think the vast majority agree that self-editing isn’t needed. The idea that comments are writing, not talking, is probably going to end up like Latin.
Ridentem dicere verum quid vetat.
Hey Harold…
Sorry you think i’m a dick. you’re not the only one. doesn;t really bother me…
i’ll stand by everything i say…and i don’t seem to have limited the discourse.
that said, “over-educated” “privileged” “Nimby” & “hipster” all have specific definitions & connotations that i think are understood by most readers here.
Aut viam inveniam aut faciam!
I live in the Haight and I’ll tell you, when AA moved in here, the area really went downhill. Now it’s full of tourists and it always rains. The coffee tastes of ash and the streets run red with blood. Don’t let it happen to your neighborhood.
heh. that said, most of the blood in the hood here is on the other side of mission street.
i’ll let y’all draw your own conclusions / snarky remark there.
Y’know I was almost ready to jump on the band wagon to support the crusade against the AA store in the Mission until I saw a sign in a shop window today that made me reevaluate my decision. It said “Our Mission Not Their’s”. I can’t really understand why these so called “Hipsters” who are really just a bunch of runny nosed spoiled little posers think the Mission belongs to THEM?? I have lived in the Mission/Dolores Park area for 35 years and believe me it was frikking beautiful before all these little cretins moved here. The store that they are protesting is a store that caters almost exclusively to their demographic and I am sure they will all be shopping there so what is the fuss??
By the way, the owners of “Ritual” are transplants from somewhere else who came here to make their fortune, so they should get off of their soapbox. What a bunch of affected phonies! These so called “Hipsters” that claim they “Own the Mission” are the same bunch of creeps that are driving around the neighborhood in their SUV’s and Beamers sipping on their “Ritual” Latte and watching their dog crap in Dolores Park. If you don’t like AA don’t shop there. Hypocrites!
ha. you should take a look at their silly blog.
Oh hipster, this is too rich.
(via Eye on Blogs)
hee. that dude is some other kind of hipster. not the scum kind.
and he, in his ironic elvis costello glasses / trucker hat and “legit-art” pants is the grand arbiter. of scum i mean.
we got a big ol dose of semantics & semiotics goin on in the hood!
yelling at the pizza on my shoes.
it’s an ironic hipster! (trucker costello that is, not zinzin…)
so i wonder what the commercial threshold is for hipster activism? $10 says Apple could open a store at that corner with nary a peep.
Oh I’m ironic alright.
Very fucking ironic.
But you know, on the inside. Where it counts.
And I’m definitely a proudly aging hipster.
Hey guys bullshit is bullshit, and American Apparel is a fucking chain (=bullshit). Think about the sf neighborhoods that these stores exist “The Haight”, “The Marina”, “Union Square”, the lamest area in sf……
hipster, dumb-ass, is any bitch who wants to name call on the other bitch… Social movements are dead, and everyone’s calling everyone a sell out hipster…. You live in sf, you’re a fucking Hipster….
Live with your shit
The only thing that sucks about American Apparel is that it’s going to look like every other shop they own. Bright, Neon, Colors of clothes that I puke when I binge on Jolly Ranchers…or Robotussin… Oh and they leave their fucking lights on at night…it must be a store policy.
But you can walk out with their clothes on they don’t prosecute shoplifters….. then look like a jolly rancher with white laces…. reinvent retro
Interesting. I just watched the Planning Commission meeting courtesy of the exciting Internet. Not that many “hipsters” showed up to the planning commission meeting. It was a few people who mentioned how many years they’d been there. But it was mostly small business owners who were worried about their rent. And other small business owners (at least 4 of them) who talked about how they’d tried to rent spaces on Valencia Street, but that they just flat-out weren’t available.
So increasing retail rents —> stores go out of business (But big-box stores will save us because we need the jobs and everybody wants to work at Walmart for their good benefits?)
And you know that our international tourists come here *just for our big box stores*!
Nice post. Thanks for this image.
i’m am an individual.
i wear the same shit as all my “friends.”
my “friends” and i all buy from the same retail because we share the same concern for manufacturing “ethics.”
we often condemn others who dont agree with us.
i’m am an individual.
Dear G-D remind me to never check the comments on this subject ever again.
Hipters calling hipsters hipsters.
year later and that space and many others still empty. Let them in!
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